PollMy favorite kind of Highlander... has a modern woman for a bride. 23% calls a seventeenth-century lass his own. 6% has fangs for teeth. 10% is any who wields a big claymore and knows how to use it. 61% |
Written language of medieval ScotlandA modern character is researching medieval Scotland: what language are the documents going to be in? The time frame being researched is early 14th Century. The archives are both in Inverness and Stirling. I was told at foramnagaidhlig that there was no written Scots Gaelic at the time, and their written language would have been Irish Gaelic. Would they also have used Latin or English? What language is likely to have been used for official correspondence (say a letter from James Douglas to Robert the Bruce?) Does anyone know how easily a speaker of Scots Gaelic is going to be able to read medieval Irish Gaelic? (Ironically, my husband is from Ireland, and between us, we have a knowledge of both Irish and Scots Gaelic. They're very similar in the written word, but that's at our basic levels. I'm not sure how well that applies for the situation I'm talking about.) My character is a history fanatic turned cop, who has done a fair amount of volunteer archaeological work in his past, so I think he can reasonably have a passing knowledge of whatever language he needs to. Thanks. Added March 16th, 2010 by Laura
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~Laura~
— Laura Tue, 03/16/2010 - 5:10am
In case anyone else is interested, I'll post anything I turn up myself on this as I keep looking: http://medievalscotland.org/scotbiblio/languages.shtml
It seems that by early 1300's, the language was Common Classical Gaelic, aka Early Modern Gaelic.
~Laura~
www.bluebellstrilogy.com
— Laura Tue, 03/16/2010 - 5:51am
Hi Laura,
interesting question. I think official state-documents would have been written in Latin at the time. The Declaration of Arbroath of 1320 definitely was. But of course it was directed to the pope...
Official correspondence between members of the "Scots" (i.e. Lowland) nobility would probably heve been in French, as they were mostly Normans anyway. The Ragman Roll of 1296 in which the Scots nobility swear fealty to Edward of England is in French.
http://www.rampantscotland.com/ragman/blragman_index.htm
As for the Highlands... I fear they were not very much given to writing. Most things would have been passed by oral tradition.
Ne oublie!
— Chris Tue, 03/16/2010 - 5:52am
Laura,
from your source:
"By the fourteenth century ... [Scots] had become the dominant spoken tongue of all ranks of Scots east and south of the Highland Line, except in Galloway". It also had become the language of the royal court. "From about this time, too, the same ... tongue was beginning to be used in Caithness, Orkney, and Shetland".
So a letter from Douglas to Bruce would propbably have been in Scots.
Ne oublie!
— Chris Tue, 03/16/2010 - 5:57am
Thanks, Chris! I suspect I got distracted getting kids off to school in the middle of reading that source, lol! I love the rampantscotland site.
~Laura~
www.bluebellstrilogy.com
— Laura Tue, 03/16/2010 - 11:21am
That is a great question. I had a gentleman who was translating for me but he no longer does it, so I don't have anyone that I can ask. The information found seems to be good, those are great sites!
I would be interested in reading your trilogy.
~Sarah~
— Sarah Hoss Wed, 03/17/2010 - 12:38pm
Hi Laura! Sadly, you're way over my head, straight out of the gate. :) Thanks for weighing in, Chris!! Regardless, it sounds like an exciting story and a very intriguing character. Nothing sexier than an alpha intellectual. *g*
— veronica Wed, 03/17/2010 - 3:31pm
Thanks, Sarah!
Veronica, this sexy alpha intellectual has sort of stolen my female mc's heart against the intentions of the author! You let a guy offer your character one lousy little cup of coffee, and he won't leave, lol! It's caused some upheaval in what I intended to write.
I realized the reason the above site's very obvious words didn't sink in. I had my mind firmly north and west of the Highland line, because that's where the scene takes place, even though the character is from south and east. So he would write in Scots. I think I'm going with the Highlanders who do write doing so in Gaelic for the time being, unless I uncover further research.
~Laura~
www.bluebellstrilogy.com
— Laura Thu, 03/18/2010 - 11:02am
Ha! Totally!! Well, good luck with the story--you can't go wrong in Scots! :)
— veronica Sat, 03/20/2010 - 8:56pm
Ha! I am still trying to tell the different between the Scots Gaelic and Manx. What the freak is the difference anyway? Chris Oh wise one? LOL
Everything Chris was posted is absolutely correct and on point.
Laura are you focusing on a specific area (Highlands/Lowlands etc?) I have a character that can tell where a person is from by listening to the inflection in the voice. It has caused a bit of a problem in a sense that I now must make sure that i research the area in which said character is to be from and what they would have or would be speaking. Aye me.
~Lizzie
— bttrfly29 Tue, 05/11/2010 - 11:35am
lol ... have fun Lizzie ... lol
That is an interesting question Laura. I never would have thought about it, but it does make sense. I suppose I would expect them to write and speak in Gaelic. But that is just me, the language wasn't outlawed back in the 14th century, was it? It was later???? Oi me and dates!!! lol
Gayle
— Gayle Lee Fri, 05/21/2010 - 9:52pm
Lizzie, I am not so sure either. Scottish Gaelic and Manx seem to be quite closely related. The main difference seems to be in the spelling, because there were no written Manx sources until relatively late, so they spelled it more or less phonetically. For example in Gaelic (and Irish) Mh is pronounced as a "V" in Manx V is written as V. If you understand what I want to say...
Example: The Isle of Manx Steam Packet Co. once owned a ship called "Ellan Vannin" (Manx for "Isle of Man") In Gaelic this would have probably been written Eilean Mhannain but it still would have been pronounced Ellan Vannin.
This is how I understand the difference. But I am definitely NOT an expert on Celtic languages. So if anyone knows better (Laura?), I will be thankful for enlightenment.
Ne oublie!
— Chris Mon, 05/24/2010 - 1:25pm
You know more then me. I also think you described it very well, thank you!
~Sarah~
— Sarah Hoss Tue, 05/25/2010 - 3:21am